Vintage guitars for sale: Hofner acoustic guitars

Genuine Hofner original 1970's Western Series Removable Neck Made In Germany. Beautiful guitar does have a repair on the back that you can see however solid as a rock very smooth through the touch as well does not a big playability does not come with the case the removable the neck is a great feature for traveling
... more

Hofner Vintage 1972 12 String Acoustic Guitar as-is Made in Germanyas pictured. stable neck crack, took at hit on the bottom
Any questions, please feel free to contact us!
Great item by DeMont Guitars!
Returns not accepted from overseas and buyer should assume item is 'as-is' please feel free to ask any and all questions prior to auction end. Please email if you plan on bidder, or would like to purchase item for out-of-USA delivery
WE DO NOT DO PARTIAL REFUNDS
will ... more

This is a c 1966 Hofner model 470 that is a rare fully acoustic Arch Top by the famous german luthier "Höfner " . Most of these 470's models are fully electric having 2 pickups. During the golden age of German guitar making from the 1950s thru the 1980s, Höfner produced a variety of fabulous instruments that gained worldwide recognition. Many musicians, including Paul McCartney, relied on Höfner guitars throughout their careers due to the brand's exceptional craftsmanship. This is a gorgeous ... more

1967 Hofner President Florentine Model 66 Acoustic Archtop 5115-05 Brunette
Very cool and extremely rare model from Hofner. Rare acoustic archtop with sharp cutaway. It plays easy and sounds very good! It's in excellent condition. Not mint, but very clean overall. Just the lightest traces of use but is a great example and is complete with hard case etc
Weight: 4 2 lbs.
Fast WORLDWIDE Shipping Available! Please contact us for more details. ... more

This 1968-69 Höfner 12 string acoustic guitar is a timeless piece for any musician looking for a classic instrument with exceptional quality. Crafted with a rich mahogany body and a stunning rosewood fretboard, this guitar boasts a jumbo body type that produces a deep, resonant sound perfect for any musical genre
The guitar is a right-handed, 4 / 4 size with a brown body color that provides a warm, natural aesthetic. Its 12 string configuration allows for a fuller, more nuanced sound than a... more

Hofner HW300G Acoustic Guitar Needs Work - has twangy sound, may need new strings or other issueNo Truss RodSome scuff marks, minor smudge otherwise VG and BeautifulSols as is. Final SaleSame Day ShippingVisit my Ebay Store and search for books, cassettes, boots, electronics, CDs, Winter Vintage Coats, Tee shirts and other unique and hard to find items, Smoke free environment. Check out reviews
... more

For your consideration is this 1965 Hofner Senator Archtop in a Sunburst finish. Overall the guitar is in Good condition. The added pickup delivers excellent sound across all playing styles, truly capturing the iconic tones of your favorite players. Playability is excellent with low action & no fret wear. Pickup added, and a pro neck setup with low action
Comes with a hard shell case as shown. (A-43)
Condition, Shipping, & Setup Details:
I specialize in selling pre-owned ... more

Here we have a Vintage 1950??s Horner 457

This archtop acoustic guitar is one of the many variations of the Hofner Model 457 from Germany with a classic sunburst finish. This archtop has a maple top, sides, and back complete with a Venetian cutaway, rosewood fingerboard, zero fret, and white block inlays to match the headstock to give it a "zebra" look. This guitar plays very well considering its age and repairs that have been done to it and looks like the beautiful jazz ... more

This vintage Höfner acoustic guitar from 1974 comes in a unique gold body color and is designed for right-handed players with a 6-string configuration and 22 frets. It includes a hard case, strap, and picks, making it a complete package for any guitarist. With its classic design and accessories, this guitar is perfect for musicians looking for a high-quality instrument with a touch of nostalgia

Beautiful guitar with great sound, small blemishes that I have tried to picture. Pick ... more

Hofner Vintage Senator Guitar. Late 1950's with the earlier non rounded headstock. Sunburst colourGood condition (see images) slight damage on headstock, in need of a re-string & no pickguard Collection Only so it can be seen and tried.... more

Beautiful old Hofner Acoustic Guitar
Its near mint condition
The guitar resonates for a long long time its a pearler of a player
The intonation is perfect
I got this from a pro player that had used it for recording and I can see and hear why
It comes with the gig bag in the pictures
The guitar with be tuned down and well protected with bubble wrap & strong cardboard for its journey to its new owner
Any questions feel free to message
Paul
... more

Eine originale 50ziger Jahre ,Höfner Jazzgitarre (Archtop) mit Perlmutt Abligationen ,schöne Farbgebung -TOP Klang, mit Zubehör , aus Erbschaft!!!!! SEHR SELTEN!!!!! PRIVATVERKAUF!!!!Ausschluss jeglicher Garantie & Haftung!!!Artikel wie Foto!!!!!
... more

This Hofner Congress guitar is a rare find for any musician. With its beautiful Brunette Burst finish and working original pickups, it's sure to impress.
1957 I think. Serial Number is 5516. The 3rd digit is smudged but looks like a 1 to me.
The body has a couple of marks but is very good for 67 years old. The neck is very nice but has a few dings. They didn't fit truss rods back then but the action is nice and easy. The fretboard and frets are worn and will need work, but that goes to ... more

This is my trusty Höfner Senator Acoustic Archtop Guitar - I??ve been a proud owner for several years now. I bought it from an independent vintage guitar shop in Gullane, East Lothian.
From the location of the decal, and the headstock inlay, I can confirm it is from 1956-1957 - the same year that Sputnik I was sent into orbit!
The guitar has a beautiful brunette stained maple body, and a solid maple neck - coincidentally, the guitar has recently had the neck reset that so many vintage ... more

Vintage HÖFNER 490 - Bj. 1971
Made in Germany
12 String Akustik Gitarre
Sehr guter Zustand
aktuell sind 6 Saiten aufgezogen
... more

SchöneVintage 4 / 4 Konzertgitarre
HÖFNER ANNO - 486
Baujahr1969-1984
Decke ausgesuchte Fichte ?? Korpus Riegel-Ahorn
Klangstark ?? bundrein ?? TOP!
Sattelbreite 50 mm!
Bei der hier angebotenen Höfner Gitarre handelt es sich nach meinenRecherchen auf der Vintage-Höfner-Seite um das Modell 486, welches in demZeitraum von 1949 bis 1984 hergestellt wurde. Eine genaue Angabe des Baujahresder angebotenen Gitarre ist leider nicht ersichtlich. Der Zeitraum kann aberanhand der ... more

Vintage 1953 Hofner President *1st Year* Brunette Acoustic Archtop Guitar w OHSC
To the best of my knowledge, this is the earliest Hofner President serial number I have found. It's from the first year of President guitars - 1953 - and has the original hard case (painted) included too. A true rarity, especially with that Straten tailpiece! According to the previous owner, the first owner he purchased it off got this in Germany in the 1950s on his way from Africa to the UK, and kept it for many... more

Vintage 1960 Hofner Congress Brunette Sunburst Electric Archtop Guitar *1960s
Wonderful original 1960 Hofner Congress guitar that I am selling on commission for a Hofner collector. He's had this upgraded to an 'electric' archtop, with the added pickup and volume / tone pots. A super cool little guitar. This required a neck reset when he purchased it, so this was carried out and the neck refinished in black. It's definitely a players grade guitar but one that now plays really nice. Comes with... more

OHV is offering our only accoustic fat body committee
For 60 years of age it is in remarkable condition. There are some scratches, in fact quite a few all around the body. Cosmetic and with the nicely darkened laquer they give the instrnent this wonderfull patina. Around the side srew of the pick guard is a little touched up area and on the backside bottom edge where the ornamentel inlay ends is a tiny patch of dopped out laquer. The neck has no trussrod and is pretty chunky, but as the... more

Zustand siehe Bilder.... more

Hofner Senator 1960 in a natural maple finish / Serial No. 10 442
The good the bad and the ugly
It's a well-loved guitar but needs some attention, hence the low price, compared to others on here It's been modified for a lefty but wouldn't take much (new nut) to change it back The neck has been reset and re fretted (by a professional luthier) and it plays ok (great sound!) but could do with setting up and new strings There's plenty of signs of wear, scratches, dings and cracked varnish... more

Original Hofner Congress acoustic guitar from 1956-1957 in excellent condition, also comes with original 1950??s custom hard shell case.

Early Hofner Serial number: 3280.

No fret wear, barely been played.

This guitar is in remarkably good condition for being over 66 years old!

The action is a a little high but it??s still ok for playing basic chords.

A unique time piece for any music lover that definitely deserves more than being stuck ... more

Gitarre gebraucht, aber in sehr gutem Zustand. Mit blauer Tasche (ohne Foto). Nur Abholung in München.
... more

An opportunity to own one of the rarest Hofner guitars. Sold as requiring full restoration. Study the images as they are part of the description. The Hofner Committee Deluxe was the forerunner to the Golden Hofner and is considered an even rarer guitar. Manufactured 1958-59 it featured an eleven piece neck and wide purling to the back and front of the body. Please read the description carefully, as any questions, viewing welcome and can supply any additional images required There is evidence ... more

Realy nice Hofner 1959 guitar made in Germany. Sounds and plays great. The guitar is all original except the wood bridge. I Have the original bridge which will be in the case. I just prefer the one that's on there. Its a rare guitar . The body and neck are in great condition. The pickup sounds great . The pot that is in there is a little scratchey. I have played the guitar on stage through a Fender Princeton had it sounded great. Comes with a newer case the original is realy beat up. Please as... more

HOFNER JAZZ GUITAR :
* finish is worn
* neck is NOT too thick
* has a volume knob & output jack installed
* NO pickup
* new tuners
* plays & sounds GR 8 !
... more

Hofner Senator
In really good condition overall
Had replacement tuning peg (see photos)
Just needs a setup
... more

Rarität
Hofner  Akustik Gitarre  Anno 1977 made in Germany
Gitarre ist in einem sehr gutem gebrauchtem Zustand und venig benutzt   minimalem Gebrauchsspuren sehr gut erhalten Zustand und sehr gute Klang
Sie original Bilder
Da die neue EU-Richtlinie jetzt 1 Jahr Gewährleistung auch für Privatverkäufe vorsieht (soweit der Verkäufer es nicht ausschließt) erkläre ich , dass ich für meine privat verkauften Artikel keine ... more

HÖFNER HNC-SB New Committee, Archtop, Jazzgitarre - sehr guter Zustand!
- Spruce Top
- Flamed Maple Back & Sides
- 643mm Scale
- Ebony Fingerboard
- 44mm Nut
- Höfner Diamond Floating Neck Pickup
- Höfner Diamond Bridge Pickup
Inkl. Koffer
Sehr guter Zustand, nur im privaten Bereich gespielt!
Probespielen möglich nach Vereinbarung
KEIN Versand - nur Abholung!
... more

Hofner Senator 1957 Vintage Guitar. Serial number 4228 This is a used guitar and does have some marks and some damage round the neck area which I have tried to show on the photos Please let me know if you want some more pics This is being advertised elsewhere so could be removed if sold. Collection only.... more

Schöne 4 / 4 Konzertgitarre
aus der Meisterwerkstatt
Höfner Modell HD 73
Handarbeit ?? Rarität
Massive Fichtendecke?? Anigré-Korpus
Bundrein ??klangstark ?? klangschön ?? TOP!
Herstellungszeitraum 1985-1989 / Baujahr 1988
Das Model HD 73 von Höfner wurde indem Zeitraum von 1985 bis 1989 produziert und ist in der Mittelklasseanzusiedeln. Die HD 73 wurde in reiner HANDARBEIT hergestellt, was man auch hören kann: das hochwertige Instrument klingt hervorragend ... more

Vintage 1958 Hofner President Brunette Acoustic Archtop Guitar Hard Case *1950s
I am selling this wonderful guitar for a Hofner collector. It's a 1958 President in Brunette / Sunburst. The guitar is in wonderful condition, and comes complete with a Stagg hard case to keep it safe. It required a neck reset when he got it, and this was carried out a while back, with the heel of the neck now looking a little different to the rest of the guitar. It's priced to sell in response to this for a ... more

Edle 4 / 4 Konzertgitarre
aus derMeisterwerkstatt
Höfner Modell HD 75
Handarbeit ?? Rarität- Top!
Massive Fichtendecke?? Palisanderkorpus
Bundrein ?? klangstark?? hochwertig
Herstellung: 80er Jahre (1985-1989)

Das Model HD 75 von Höfner wurde inder zweiten Hälfte der 80er Jahre produziert und ist in der Mittelklasseanzusiedeln. Das Instrument wurde in reiner HANDARBEIThergestellt, was man auch hören kann: Das Instrument klingt einfachfantastisch
... more

SchöneVintage 7 / 8 Wandergitarre
HÖFNER ?? Modell 513
Fichtendecke ?? Ahornkorpus
Boden leicht gewölbt ?? eingelassener Halsfuß
Schöner warmer Klang ?? bundrein - TOP!
Sammler- bzw. Geschenktauglich!
Mensur62 cm ?? Sattelbreite 45 mm
Bei der hier angebotenen Gitarrehandelt es sich um das etwas kleinere Modell 513 in 7 / 8-Größe, das 1984 kurz inden Preislisten auftauchte und anschließend für immer verschwand. Das größere Modell513G in 4 / 4-Größe von ... more

Schöne4 / 4 Konzertgitarre
Höfner Modell HF 11
Germany ?? Boosey &Hawkes
Decke Fichte massiv ?? Intarsie
Bundrein ??klangschön ?? TOP!
EGTA-Empfehlung?? Sattelbreite 50 mm
Das Modell HF 11 gehört zu Recht zu einer dermeist verkauften Gitarren von Höfner und erhielt die begehrte EGTA-Empfehlung(European Guitar Teachers Association)
Das Modell HF-11 wird heute nur noch in der etwas verkleinertenVersion als 7 / 8 Gitarre mit 63 cm Mensur und 48 mm Sattelbreite ... more

Hofner Senator - 1960 natural maple finish
A seriously gorgeous piece of musical history, just awesome At some point there's bound to be a need for repair on an old (vintage) guitar I had a professional reset the neck and set up the action, so it now plays beautifully
According to serial numbers, this is one of 2098 made in 1960 Possibly rarer by the fact it is a natural maple finish (there were several different finish styles), rather than the sunburst Express24 next working day ... more

This 1957 Hofner Congress Archtop Acoustic Guitar is a must-have for any serious musician. Made in Germany, it features a beautiful brown body with a 6-string configuration. The guitar is right-handed and has a model year of 1957, making it a vintage piece for collectors and enthusiasts alike.
The guitar's brand, Hofner, is known for producing high-quality instruments, and this Congress model is no exception. It is part of the Original series and has a model name of Congress. The body type ... more

Schöne Höfner Gitarre in gutem Zustand, hat sehr lange im Koffer geschlummert und nur leichte Gebrauchsspuren sind zu sehen (kleine Kratzer), vom Fachmann neu eingestellt, sehr gut bespielbar Die Tonabnehmer hatten Ihre Leistung verloren und wurden deshalb neu gewickelt, jetzt klingt sie wieder gut Der Koffer ist im Verkaufspreis enthalten Die Gitarre kann angespielt und abgeholt werden. Versand ist möglich... more

Schöne 4 / 4 Konzertgitarre
Höfner Lizenz ISIGL
Musikstudent MSIII - 1987
Handarbeit - TOP!
Massive Fichtendecke ?? Macorekorpus - Intarsie
Klangstark ?? klangschön - bundrein

Artikelbeschreibung in Kurzformfür Schnellleser:
Hochwertigeshandgearbeitetes Markeninstrument aus deutscher WerkstattSehrvoller, schöner, warmer, anhaltender und ausgewogener Klang, sehr guteAnspracheGuteBespielbarkeit mit Saitenlage von ca. 5 mm im 12. Bund (E6)MassiveFichtendecke, ... more

HOFNER JAZZ GUITAR - made in GERMANY :
* had a repair at heel=check last 2 pics
* body has a nice flamed maple back
* fingerboard has a hump towards the end
* needs tuners, bridge & tail piece... more

Höfner Meisterwerkstatten
Konzertgitarre 4 / 4- Baujahr
1977- Seltenes Modell
Hallo liebe Gitarrenfreunde
hier biete ich eine schöne,
seltene und alte Konzertgitarre
der Marke Höfner Anno
Meisterwerkstätten in voller 4 / 4-
Größe an - für Erwachsene und
Jugendliche geeignet. Die Gitarre
stammt aus dem Jahr 1977 und
hat die Jahre gut überstanden
Pflege & Zustand:
Sie wurde gründlich gereinigt, die
Bundstäbchen wurden sauber
geschliffen,... more

1958 hofner committee. Great condition . Condition is Used. Dispatched with Royal Mail 2nd Class Letter.... more

Selling on behalf of a friend who doesn't have an ebay account
Beautiful and rare vintage Höfner President archtop acoustic guitar.
Serial number is #4266 which means it was made in 1958. Check it at vintagehofner co uk
Wonderful bright, vital tone. Action and playability both good
Clearly well cared for, various age-related marks but nothing structural
Recently set up with new strings by music shop
Priced to sell.
No hard case, collection only from SE London.... more

seltene Höfner 456 Archtop Jazz Gitarre Vintage 1958 mit Originalkoffer
Diese seltene Höfner Jazz Gitarre 456 aus 1958 ist in einem guten bis sehr guten Erhaltungszustand. Zargen und Boden sind aus Ahorn, die Decke ist aus Fichte. Die Gitarre ist gepflegt, wurde vor kurzem neu besaitet, hat einen vollen Klang und ist auch komfortabel bespielbar. Bünde und Griffbrett sind in TOP-Zustand! An dieser Gitarre war im Originalzustand wohl ein Pickup (am Hals) montiert. Ein passendes Loch zur ... more

Vintage 1958 Hofner Senator Blonde Natural Electric Archtop Guitar Case *1950s
I am selling this wonderful guitar for a Hofner collector. It's a 1958 Senator in natural, with an added blade pickup and volume / tone knobs. The guitar is in wonderful condition, and comes complete with a vintage hard case to keep it safe. The neck is sturdy as ever and, although there is a slight crack to the heel, has been secured. There is a small buzz to the 13th fret, otherwise plays nicely. It's priced to ... more

Vintage 1957 Hofner Congress Brunette Sunburst Electric Archtop Guitar *1950s
Wonderful original 1957 Hofner Congress guitar that I am selling on commission for a Hofner collector. He's had this upgraded to an 'electric' archtop, with the added pickup and volume / tone pots. A super cool little guitar. It plays really nice, and only has a few light marks to it, as pictured. Comes with a nice vintage hard case, as pictured. Priced to sell - you'll not find a better one for the price! Please ... more

Zustand siehe Bilder.... more

Hofner Committee 1956
In very good vintage condition with the original case. Very nice playing condition. No buzzes. All original. Small glue splodge on the pickguard. Can probably be removed. (See photos)
FREE UK DELIVERY INTERNATIONAL SHIPPING ALSO AVAILABLE... more

Re-Listed as I made an error in indicating a fret board change instead of saying a picguard change. The fret board is as manufactured and in good shape
Selling my 1958 Hofner Senator Acoustic Guitar No. 6986. Its Blond in colour and has a great patena produced over the 67 years of its life. It has had a neck reset. Type 1 Bakerlite Cased pickup is fitted, but as I cannot check this item for life, please presume for the sake of this sale as not working. It has a single control control panel, ... more

Parlour Konzertgitarre aus dem Jahr 1955 , von der deutschen Gitarrenschmiede HÖFNEER Ein vintage Instrument in gutemZustand Die Gitarre hat einen eingeleimtenHals und ist sehr solide verarbeitet Die Decke ist aus massiver Fichte, dieZargen und der Boden aus laminiertemMahagoniDer Hals ist aus Ahorn, während das Griffbrett aus Palisander gearbeitet ist Die Bünde sind ohne Kerben Die Mechaniken funktionieren gut Es gibt Kratzer, und kleineMacken auf dem Instrument, ohneernsthafte Schäden ... more

Alters-Gebrauchsspuren. Zustand siehe Bilder. Funktion nicht geprüft.... more

4 / 4 Hofner 378 Flamenco serial 3633 Acoustic Guitar 1955 / 6 model This was the first model of this series made in late 1955 early 1956 and can be identified by the Hofner mark on the front is stamped in rather than been a waterslide sticker. (My Uncle bought this new in 1956 he said) He also said they used far better woods in the early models up until 1959
The fretboad from fret 1 to 4 is pitted from use but does not affect the sound or playability. I could have this sanded down but i ... more

Vintage 1967 Hofner Congress Brunette Sunburst Electric Archtop Guitar *1960s
Wonderful original 1967 Hofner Congress guitar that I am selling on commission for a Hofner collector. He's had this upgraded to an 'electric' archtop, with the added pickup and volume / tone pots. A super cool little guitar. It plays really nice, and only has a few light marks to it, as pictured. Comes with a nice vintage hard case, as pictured. Priced to sell - you'll not find a better one for the price! Please ... more

Höfner 491 von 1968 zu verkaufen
Diese Slope Shoulder Westerngitarre ist für ihr Alter in sehr gutem Zustand
Der Hals ist gerade und die Intonation perfekt
Die Saitenhöhe am 12. Bund beträgt 2 mm
Sie lässt sich hervorragend spielen und klingt wunderbar
Sie hat sicherlich ihre Macken nach 57 Jahren, siehe Fotos
Fotos sind Bestandteil dieses Angebots
Wird mit einem Vintage Gitarrenkoffer geliefert
Angebote sind willkommen
Höfer 491
Westerngröße, ... more

Excellent vintage (mid 1960s) guitar for the money and rare to find one in this good a condition. Has recently had studio use and is sounding great. Does not include a case, buyer must collect from Bath.... more

You are viewing a vintage Hofner Senator Brunette Acoustic Guitar in good clean vintage condition Obvious marks of use here and there Recently restrung and tuned, plays well Action measured at 12th fret Please see photographs to assess condition Size is 1040mm x 410mm Pickup is BB48RR... more

Vintage 1964 Hofner Senator Blonde Natural Electric Archtop Guitar Case *1960s
I am selling this wonderful guitar for a Hofner collector. It's a 1964 Senator in natural, with an added pickup and volume / tone knobs. The guitar is in wonderful condition, and comes complete with a hard case to keep it safe. The neck is sturdy as ever and it plays great. Sold for a bargain price! Please have a close look at the high resolution photographs below, as these form part of our description
... more

Step right up to meet the pristine 1960 Hofner Congress??a vintage marvel that has been lovingly preserved and still dazzles like a rock ?n roll time machine. Outfitted with brand-new D??Addario EJ15 phosphor bronze light strings, this classic guitar strums retro grooves with a modern zing, perfectly balancing its storied past with a fresh, contemporary sparkle. With its polished finish and impeccably maintained condition, the 1960 Hofner Congress is the charming dapper gentleman of any Guitar ... more

Rare 1950s top quality Archtop guitar in amazing condition In style and quality it sits between a Hofner Committee and President
Solid Spruce top, beautifully carved to match the contours of the body. (Look around the cutaway )Laminated back and sides with striking flame / quilted veneer 3-piece laminated neck with Ebony fingerboard.
Dating by comparison with contemporary Hofners, I make it between 1953 and 1955 Using Steve Russell's site for reference, the 3 strip ornate tuners on ... more

Schöne 4 / 4 Konzertgitarre
aus der Meisterwerkstatt
Höfner Modell HD 73
Handarbeit ?? Rarität
Massive Fichtendecke?? Anigré-Korpus
Bundrein ??klangstark ?? klangschön ?? TOP!
Herstellungszeitraum 1985-1989 / Baujahr 1988
Das Model HD 73 von Höfner wurde indem Zeitraum von 1985 bis 1989 produziert und ist in der Mittelklasseanzusiedeln. Die HD 73 wurde in reiner HANDARBEIT hergestellt, was man auch hören kann: das hochwertige Instrument klingt hervorragend ... more

Alters-Gebrauchsspuren. Zustand siehe Bilder. Funktion nicht geprüft.... more

Luxuriöse Höfner Committee Jazzgitarre, gebaut Ende der 50er Jahre Sehr hochwertiges Instrument mit gewölbten Vogelaugenahorn Boden und Zargen, die Decke aus Fichte Kunstvolles Kopfplatten Design, Griffbrett aus Ebenholz mit echtem perlmutt Wundervoller klang, Elektronik funktioniert nur teilweise eine Einstellung rauscht, vermutlich leicht zu beheben Alles Original, Sammlerstück, Rarität.... more

DOLLAR DEALERS COBURG
Description
C1960s Hofner Senator Archtop Acoustic GUitar w / Celluloid Pickguard
Nice c1960s German made archtop acoustic guitar featuring double bound body, bound f holes, Hofner compensator tailpiece, original celluloid pickguard and adjustable bridge.
The condition is good for a 60 year old guitar but has a high action at current so would either make a great slide guitar as is, or with a proper set up and truss adjustment should hopefully be more playable ... more